Replying to [tworiverstradingco]:
Hi,
I would like to reply about the site whois.org.
They only display the datas they are given. And please remember that the datas they are given (from registrars for example) are fullfilled by human beeing.

I checked out 1 hour ago for our own site and it looks like they still have our first adress when we launched the company.
We wrote/called our registration internet company when we moved. They said that the informations were well aknowleged.
But it looks like the are just able to keep saying like robots such things as "thank you for having updated your datas".

Of course they send the invoices to the right adress. They want to be paid properly, am I right ?
BUT, still 2 years after our moving, the old adress appears in the site whois.org.
Even if I must admitt that before reading your post I didn't even knew the existence of the site whois.org, it's kind of pissing me off though...

So, obviously, if we look at our alibaba profile, there is a gap between the 2 sites.
We are then the proof that having 2 differents datas logs (phone number, adress etc), is not really a proof of scam

If that can help here are some governmental French sites where datas are more frequently updated (of course they update it!! they are all related to Fisc and Taxes)
www.cci.fr
www.societe.com (in this one, you can search for a company based in France, you'll have its official patent number, its fiscal adress etc..)

This works for France but maybe in other countries it is not that different. Trades and and business is more and more worldwide, it's a shame that all governments do not apply same procedures all around the world (even simplified ones) so that we know that we can find "scamproof" informations every where.

You know like when you are in a foreign country, even a country you can't even spell the name before landing there, you're 100% sure that you'll find your homeland embassy or consultate there. Or at least, a "friendly" country embassy.
Maybe the Chambers of Commerce and Industry can localy help us. They all have Internet am I right ? Even those from tighny little countries. My recommandation would be to use their knowledge.

I'm sure if someone contact them and say : Hi I'm willing to do good business with one company in your country, but before that I need to know if they exist.
I'm sure they will be able to answer properly.

Meanwhile, since it looks like people from different countries are in this Platform (Alibaba) each of you could enlight us about his own country. Especially from the Countries that seems to be pointed out as "major providers" of scammers and fraudsters.

I am sure you will all agree that keeping saying things like "People from this country are all scammer/fraudster" or "people who's name is not Jones or Smith are all scammer and fraudsters" is unproductive and useless.
Beside it's sounds sometimes like racism though

Lets share information about our own countries in a non passionate way. I'm sure it will be profitable for all of us.

Regards,
Ludesa.com

Replying to [tworiverstradingco]:
Replying to [TwinMOS]:
BEST WAY FIRST YOU CHECK BY THIS WAY-
YOU SAY THAT WITHIN FEW DAYS YOU ARE GOING TO HIS COUNTRY SO YOU WANT A VISIT THEM.AND YOU WANT TO PAY BY CASH.SEND A INVITATIONS.IF THEY ARE FRAUD THEN I AM SURE THEY WILL VANISH.
BUT APPLY THIS PROCESS ONLY IF YOU THINK OR YOU ARE FELLING DOUBT ABT THEM.
1-IF THEY AGREE IN LOW PRICE
2-IF THEY USE ONLY MOBILE NUMBER
3-IF THEY USE SAME NUMBER PHONE & FAX.
4.IF THEY MOST OF TIME ONLINE
5-IF THEY TRY TO PLEASED BUY & USED WESTERN UNION.
6- IF THEY GIVE MANY REFERENCE AND VERY INTEREST TO DEAL THAT SHUD BE A GENUINE SUPPLIER.
7-ONLY CONTACT BY EMAIL.

SUGGESSTION- IF YOU DOUBT ON THEM THEN ALWAYS TELL THEM TO CALL AND ALWAYS SEND ALL OFFER AND DETAILS BY FAX .MAYBE ITS A GOOD WAY TO KNOW A FRAUD.BCOS FAX AND PHONE CALL COST MONEY AND FRAUD CONTACT SO MANY MANY BUYER SO I THINK HE WILL NOT ABLE TO SPEND THIS COST REGULALRLY.

I recently started using Alibaba and other B2B sites more frequently.

Though I am cheated once for my MP4, purchase, it was 256 MB against 1 GB as mentioned in quotes and order.

I suggest members to follow following rules while dealing with suppliers of B2B portal.

1. Every portal has their verification mechanism, ofcourse they are suppose to varify physical existance most of the times, but still verified members are more reliable, at times they may be expensive, but then you dont loose all.

2. Once message is sent from portals contact mechanism, buyer must suggest them to send e mails from their mail ID to your mail ID.

3. Always check and verify origin location of e mail, by checking IP address in mail source. You can verify it at www.iptools.com or such sites.

4. if you find that person who is claiming to be from X country and is from Y country, then never ever deal with them.

5. Businesses which ask for only western union payments, never deal with them.

6. If you are given T/T option, then too analyze IP addresses. There rogue countries, who allow T/T or open bank accounts without any verifications.

7. Person or business who has only mobile number are not reliable. Best way to check whether number given is mobile or fixed line, is to send TEXT message from your mobile and request message acknowledgment. If it is mobile number, message will be delivered, if fixed wire line, then message will not be delivered.

8. Always check local time while chatting. So that you will come to know whether a person is an individual or a company, companies and their people will not be online at odd hours, say mid night.

Hope useful
Kalpak

Replying to [tworiverstradingco]:
Hi
Here is one i have just before, i have contacted a factory but still unsure if they are a factory or office or scam, i contacted a company in that area that i know is good and ask if they knew this company, changes are there will be a company at that address location.
at the end of the day if i was to send $40k to a company was not sure about then i would first travel to meet face to face, always the best way, i sleep better too.
John

Replying to [tworiverstradingco]:I want to fault your reason.Many of Chinese factories ,especially those located in suburbs does not register thier companies with websites ,some of them do not eve have anything to do with foreign trade,but since China opened up more and allowed more locals to operate foreign trade ,some of the less priviledge companies employ new english graduates and some of this graduates will jump into Ali Baba to source for customers.Therefore they are not powered enough to register the company pending when the ali baba link will ba paying dividend by bringing them customers.Therefore is we should use your yard stick to judge them ,we can crown them thieves ,when they are not.
On the other hand ,any company that wants to be fraudlent will go extra miles to make some things look legit.
Anyway if you want to know companies that are legit ,ask them peculiar questions related to the trade they are suppose to be projecting,and you will see them rambling like small baby .

Replying to [tworiverstradingco]: There is also a type of scam where the buyer asks for a lot of sample items from the unsuspecting supplier. Companies especially the small ones are very over eager to get orders never thinking that they are being scammed. They go to trade fairs and bring a freight consolidator and ask for samples from a lot of Companies. They can actually load a full container with the freebies.

Replying to [tworiverstradingco]:

I would suggest you keep bumping this till the cows come home. Like you I have discovered a great many people on this site who think they can just do business without any experience at all. Then they wonder why they get burned.

Has anyone really asked themselves the "Big Question".

LIKE:......Why do scammers and scams seem more common on Alibaba.

ANSWER:.....Look in the mirror. You are the cause.


LEARN TO IDENTIFY, IF IT SOUNDS TO GOOD TO BE TRUE IT IS.

Replying to [tworiverstradingco]:1000000000000000000 thanks this is what we all need to know , This posting should be read by every one on Alibaba ,, let us all make 2007 , distroy as many scamers as we can

Replying to [tworiverstradingco]:
One more not bad AntiScam site is http://www.antiscamclub.com It's free site. I know that some antiscam sites asks money for their service. As for me I don't understand this fact. When users themselves post reports and pay money for viewing other reports.

Replying to [Ludesa]:Wow.You make a good sample to teach us...Thanks!!!