Hi all,
I've been using Alibaba regularly over the last 2-3 years or so and it seems to me that
this B2B site is perhaps growing too fast and with too much emphasis on getting ahead
without setting its own backyard in order.
There are so many issues for which there seems to be no end or solution in sight. For
eg: Scammers in the guise of Gold suppliers and Trust pass members.
It seems to me Alibaba is only thinking of creating more revenue streams for itself
without mopping up certain potential landmines on its sites. Alibaba seems to charge
exorbitant fees for its Gold membership and Trust Pass schemes. How come scammers
and fraudsters are also able to get in ? Is this fair on the several thousand genuine
Gold/Trust Pass registered suppliers out there or indeed on the buyers who have
paid-up their memberships ?
It seems sad that Alibaba cannot divert a little chunk of its revenue into clearing up
its own website first. Just the other day I saw a supplier advertising knock-off
football jerseys. The only thing missing is the actual brand logo - so, does this
qualify as acceptable ? How would you like it if someone ripped off your ideas and
products that way ? Funnier still was the fact that this same supplier was a Gold
Supplier ! How ??
I could go on about cetain other stuff on this site but I guess all the regulars here
already know the flaws that need to be addressed - and addressed in a hands-on
way.
I just wonder how long all this is going to last ? Was this the way Jack Ma envisioned
things to be for his little start-up of yester-year ?
It's about time China has some kind of well-functioning "Better Business Bureau" and that consequently Alibaba weeds out all member (even paid members) who are blacklisted there.
I understand that Alibaba can't see at first sight if a company is honest, though it looks like they take the "background check" of applicants a little too easy, and they also are too reluctant to pull the plug on proven cheaters. That can and therefore has to be changed.
You are absolutely right, Germex ! Spot on.
I think a couple of days back I read a comment from "Alibaba TrustPass team HK"
that Gold supplier and Trust Pass only indicates that the relevant company is a
legally registered entity. They have no way to verify if they are crooks or not. Forget
the fact that a kaziilion other members may have already complained about so and
so company being fraudsters, crooks, etc. They just turn a blind eye.
So, basically one could interpret that like this:
"We (Alibaba) charge astronomical fees from our paid-up memebers ONLY for the
trivial and straight-forward task of verifying that your company exists. If you should
decide to become a crook to make back some of your money (taken by us) from
an unsuspecting member here at Alibaba, go ahead ! What do we care, we've made
our cut on this!"
"We here at Alibaba take pride in parting your hard-earned money from you"
Come on Alibaba. You know full well that you are in business today because of the
support you get from all your members - paid or unpaid. It's the least you could do for us,
to make this community that much safer....
Case in point:
Put up 2 posts on Alibaba - one enquiring about Trust Pass fees and one complaining
about a swindler on Alibaba. Just see which post gets replied faster by the Alibaba
team ;)
Quoting from [Giant Trader]:Hi all,
I've been using Alibaba regularly over the last 2-3 years or so and it seems to me that
this B2B site is perhaps growing too fast and with too much emphasis on getting ahead
without setting its own backyard in order.There are so many issues for which there seems to be no end or solution in sight. For
eg: Scammers in the guise of Gold suppliers and Trust pass members.It seems to me Alibaba is only thinking of creating more revenue streams for itself
without mopping up certain potential landmines on its sites. Alibaba seems to charge
exorbitant fees for its Gold membership and Trust Pass schemes. How come scammers
and fraudsters are also able to get in ? Is this fair on the several thousand genuine
Gold/Trust Pass registered suppliers out there or indeed on the buyers who have
paid-up their memberships ?
It seems sad that Alibaba cannot divert a little chunk of its revenue into clearing up
its own website first. Just the other day I saw a supplier advertising knock-off
football jerseys. The only thing missing is the actual brand logo - so, does this
qualify as acceptable ? How would you like it if someone ripped off your ideas and
products that way ? Funnier still was the fact that this same supplier was a Gold
Supplier ! How ??
I could go on about cetain other stuff on this site but I guess all the regulars here
already know the flaws that need to be addressed - and addressed in a hands-on
way.
I just wonder how long all this is going to last ? Was this the way Jack Ma envisioned
things to be for his little start-up of yester-year ?
Jacks little party is over, take a look at his share price
http://finance.yahoo.com/q/bc?s=1688.HK&t=1y&l=on&z=m&q=l&c=
Alibaba spends a fortune on google with over 84k keywords linked to them, if they spent that on due diligence the site would get enough organic traffice it wouldn't need Google.
The whole sight is a farce...I would not pay these charlitans.
The HK regulators of the Hong Kong Stock Exchange also turn a blind eye on their fellow Chinamen scamming the world.
I'd rather do a deal with a Nigerian email scammer, at least they are honest!
Giant Trader mentions paid and unpaid members. I'm glad to see that there are more people who realize that even unpaid members mean business to Alibaba, though obviously more indirectly.
Why would somebody who only occassionally sells or buys something pay for a full membership? It doesn't make sense! But what makes sense is that due to the non-paying members there is also more business for paying members, and that makes this website more attractive.
And it is this attraction that makes Alibaba permanently interesting for traders, including those who pay. Anything else is hog wash and at the very best a temporary "fast buck".
Now, you think that Jack's little party is over? That would be bad news for us! After all, Alibaba (as it shouldbe) is the best thing since sliced bread for us. Let's hope and pray they'll get their act together!
Hi germex and kulcha,
Thank you both for your comments. Well stated, both of you. Like germex, I too hope
that Alibaba will clean up their act - and soon....
Cheers
Sam
Quoting from [Giant Trader]:Hi germex and kulcha,
Thank you both for your comments. Well stated, both of you. Like germex, I too hope
that Alibaba will clean up their act - and soon....Cheers
Sam
Maybe we could be proactive and suggest some changes. Remembering the laws of marketing, I feel like Alibaba should make it somehow attractive to pay for a membership. That could mean for example that anybody can trade without major restrictions via Alibaba (without that seven-day limit for free members, for example, as that also affects the paying members), but for a paying member the procedure to make contact should be faster and easier, aside from other advantages.
That would automatically divide people inteo groups. Those who use Alibaba frequently will want to pay, to have the same service faster and easier. After all, time is money. And the one who only uses this service occassionally will prefer to go through all the hassle of contacting the prospective trade partner, as it doesn't make sense to pay, just to have faster acces only once or twice a year.
If the free member could have access to prospective trade partners just as soon as the paid member (no seven-day limit), everybody would win; the paid member, the free member and Alibaba (becoming more attractive for everybody).
The only question for me is, how exactly should Alibaba proceed to make life easier and more pleasant for paid members? Please let's discuss this!
germex,
thank you for your qualified comments. pls spare a moment to browse this link:
http://www.alibaba.com/buyofferdetail/100893870/Buy_Mini_Speaker_Portable_Speakers.html
i noticed this while casually looking up some "buying leads" this morning. On the main
enquiry page, there seems to be a TrustPass link for this company but when you proceed
to click on the link, it takes you to the page of a FREE member. Is it just me or is this
a flaw in the system ? If it is, then it's a very serious one indeed.
And this is not the only profile to initially show a Trust pass logo on it, and thereafter connecting you to the profile of a free member. It's unlikely that this company had a TrustPass profile before because they've only joined Alibaba.com this year (2008).
Here is another link:
http://www.alibaba.com/buyofferdetail/100217409/Want_Speakers_For_Ipod.html
There is a TrustPass logo shown on this member's contact card as well, but when
you click on it, you end up at the page of a free member....
I worry about what may become of our suggestions to improve the trading platform at
Alibaba.com.....it seems obvious that Alibaba.com is now only living on its faded glory.
Maybe we could be proactive and suggest some changes. Remembering the laws of marketing, I feel like Alibaba should make it somehow attractive to pay for a membership. That could mean for example that anybody can trade without major restrictions via Alibaba (without that seven-day limit for free members, for example, as that also affects the paying members), but for a paying member the procedure to make contact should be faster and easier, aside from other advantages.
That would automatically divide people inteo groups. Those who use Alibaba frequently will want to pay, to have the same service faster and easier. After all, time is money. And the one who only uses this service occassionally will prefer to go through all the hassle of contacting the prospective trade partner, as it doesn't make sense to pay, just to have faster acces only once or twice a year.
If the free member could have access to prospective trade partners just as soon as the paid member (no seven-day limit), everybody would win; the paid member, the free member and Alibaba (becoming more attractive for everybody).
The only question for me is, how exactly should Alibaba proceed to make life easier and more pleasant for paid members? Please let's discuss this!
That's a very good idea, germex. I understand where you're getting at. My only concern is
whether Alibaba.com would actually be willing forego the cream they currently make from
the Gold suppliers on their site.
The amounts they charge are exorbitant. Despite paying such huge fees, the majority
of Gold suppliers are still moaning about the lack of real customers through Alibaba.com.
If I am reading your suggestions correctly, Alibaba.com's subscriptions fees would need
to become more uniform & transparent so that everyone has an equal chance to opt for free or paid membership. Paid membership should be within the reach of every genuine
company or indivdual. Not like it currently stands, pricing certain companies out of the site
completely by demanding a king's ransom for Gold supplier status. What do you think ?
Perhaps the plus side would be more members willing to pay up if the fees were reasonable and the access to the Alibaba.com database (buyer/seller leads) was more transparent.
In addition, maybe Alibaba.com should divide its members by colour-coding them according to their legal entity type: say, individuals buyers, Individual sellers, factories (proper factories!) etc etc.
Most important of all would be to set up a review panel to scour through the site on a
regular basis and get rid of the not-so-good elements (eg: scammers).
Regarding the willingness to adopt changes, I have the feeling that Alibaba is already hearing the uproar and therefore willing (probably even planning) to implement changes. So now there is a better chance that our complaints and suggestions won't encounter deaf ears.
More kinds of membership with the corresponding privileges and aids might be (one part of) the solution. But most importantly, I think Alibaba has to fully understand that in business nothing works in the long run if there isn't a clear win-win situation.
As long as people clearly see that it is worth it to pay a certain type of membership fee, everything is fine. Customers (especially if they are business people themselves) understand that they get nothing for nothing.
Even in the case of free members, in the end somebody is paying their share: the paid member. The deal here is that it doesn't make sense to charge anything and to do the corresponding bookkeeping for an occassional use of Alibaba's service. And as on a global scale paid members benefit from free members as well, they each include their share of a few cents for free members.
Now, Alibaba obviously (and rightfully) wants them to become paid members. How can they achieve that? I believe this has to happen "by itself". If business increases due to the use of Alibaba, but finding new partners or maintaining contact with them is a little clumsy and time-consuming for a free member - though not for a paid member - they'll opt for paying the fee.
Though as long as the free member hasn't arrived at a point where paying isn't reasonable for him, let him continue without obstruction. He either is a good business man and will succeed one day (seeing then the advantages of being a paid member) or drop out of the race.
The reason I insist so much on treating free members fairly is that here a company like Alibaba can show their business sense. If they treat them as future paid customers, they look good and will convert many into paid members. But if they treat them basically like "cheap panhandlers", they won't attract too many of them.
I have the impression that right now many free members are observing, trying to find out if becoming a paid member is a good idea. "Catching" them to become paid members is what Alibaba needs for the better of everybody, so I hope they make the right decisions and are creative in the ways we can work with them.
To put it this way: who cares if Alibaba makes a lot of money, as long as it is because they help us make a lot of money, too!
I agree with your views, germex. They are obviously well thought-out and definitely
workable if Alibaba make the effort.
I think it's rather obvious that there are multiple issues to be addressed by Alibaba.com
as far as safety and improvements are concerned. What is important to one member
may be less important to another member - so on and so forth.
I read in the news some days back that Alibaba has US$2Bln of cash reserves which
they intend to use for tough times. I wonder, does no one from their executive management
team know about the problems we try to addresss every now and then ? Why not use
some of that money to enhance the site and make it better ?
This site is close to becoming a farce. BIG TIME.
I think if they're really serious about fixing things up, they should do it once and for all after a careful review of all grievances. Look, I know new issues will always come up sometime in the future - but the least they could do is fix up things they are already aware of, correct ?