Patent Information
Post 1 of 5
Hello All!
This is my first time posting and I just wanted to thank everyone in advance - I've already looked over some of the topics and there's such a wealth of information I get lost. That said, if my questions are already answered somewhere else please refer me to the location!
So, first question: How can I find out if a product I'm interested in buying doesn't infringe on a patent in my country (in this case the USA)? A friend and I invested some money and ended up with counterfeit product that we couldn't sell here. Before we bought it we tried to determine if there was a patent on it and if it was legal to purchase the product from China and resell it here, but I guess we didn't look in the right places. Are there certain steps we can take in the future to avoid this problem?
Okay, second question: I've heard that if you create a product and do not patent it, it is possible for another company to copy it and then PATENT IT THEMSELVES!! Is this true? I've read a book where the author advised against getting a patent on the basis that if your product is successful enough, other companies will design around your patent and essentially copy your product legally. I'm very tempted to take the no-patent route (seems much less time/money consuming) and I'm not very worried about people copying the product and selling it - but the thought they could patent my own idea is a little disconcerting. Could anyone shed a little light on the subject?
Thanks so much, everyone. I'm looking forward to learning from and participating in this community!
Regards,
Darin
This is my first time posting and I just wanted to thank everyone in advance - I've already looked over some of the topics and there's such a wealth of information I get lost. That said, if my questions are already answered somewhere else please refer me to the location!
So, first question: How can I find out if a product I'm interested in buying doesn't infringe on a patent in my country (in this case the USA)? A friend and I invested some money and ended up with counterfeit product that we couldn't sell here. Before we bought it we tried to determine if there was a patent on it and if it was legal to purchase the product from China and resell it here, but I guess we didn't look in the right places. Are there certain steps we can take in the future to avoid this problem?
Okay, second question: I've heard that if you create a product and do not patent it, it is possible for another company to copy it and then PATENT IT THEMSELVES!! Is this true? I've read a book where the author advised against getting a patent on the basis that if your product is successful enough, other companies will design around your patent and essentially copy your product legally. I'm very tempted to take the no-patent route (seems much less time/money consuming) and I'm not very worried about people copying the product and selling it - but the thought they could patent my own idea is a little disconcerting. Could anyone shed a little light on the subject?
Thanks so much, everyone. I'm looking forward to learning from and participating in this community!
Regards,
Darin
28 Aug 2007 03:41
Post 2 of 5
Quoting from [coshoperate]:
Hello All!
This is my first time posting and I just wanted to thank everyone in advance - I've already looked over some of the topics and there's such a wealth of information I get lost. That said, if my questions are already answered somewhere else please refer me to the location!
So, first question: How can I find out if a product I'm interested in buying doesn't infringe on a patent in my country (in this case the USA)? A friend and I invested some money and ended up with counterfeit product that we couldn't sell here. Before we bought it we tried to determine if there was a patent on it and if it was legal to purchase the product from China and resell it here, but I guess we didn't look in the right places. Are there certain steps we can take in the future to avoid this problem? Need to check with the patent Office in your country. Also talk to Customs as well.
Okay, second question: I've heard that if you create a product and do not patent it, it is possible for another company to copy it and then PATENT IT THEMSELVES!! Aboslutely anyone can copy your design if you do not patent it. (Check laguiole out)
28 Aug 2007 09:02
Post 3 of 5
[How can I find out if a product I'm interested in buying doesn't infringe on a patent in my country (in this case the USA)?]
Patents can be worldwide or country specific so to be thorough you will have to check quite extensively on the issue.
There should be a local database that you can access to check USA registrations but it is a time expensive process as it is often difficult to actually search for an item that has no name but is instead an idea. It can be done but it takes patience.
I guess that the above is the reason that many people contract the services of a specialized patent attorney as they are more skilled at doing the appropriate searches.
[ Are there certain steps we can take in the future to avoid this problem? ]
There are two steps that I can think of:
1. Don't buy brand name products in China nor items that are clearly going to infringe upon the the patent/copyright of others.
2. Make specific checks on specific products with your customs authorities back home to ensure that the item/s that you are importing have the correct certifications to get through customs and be available for sale on the local market.
[I've heard that if you create a product and do not patent it, it is possible for another company to copy it and then PATENT IT THEMSELVES!! Is this true?]
No and yes. Legally if you can prove that the idea was not their original idea and already in the public domain then they cannot patent that idea. So if you see a product that does not have a patent you cannot rush out and patent it because it is already known to others and considered in the public domain.
Of course if you have an original idea and don't patent it and someone else picks up on that and does patent it before there is proof that it is already in the public domain then that would be a legitimate (although somewhat underhanded) patent.
[I've read a book where the author advised against getting a patent on the basis that if your product is successful enough, other companies will design around your patent and essentially copy your product legally.]
Strange advice.
The idea of a patent is to protect your original design. A patent is not meant to stop others from 'being inspired' by your original design and 'improving' upon it. So while a patent registration by its very nature will put the details of your design out there, this detail is what provides your original design with the protection that it deserves. If other make a product based upon your patent design but with small changes or improvements then that is legitimate business.
If you don't patent the idea then it will be a free for all especially if the product is successful!
Patents can be worldwide or country specific so to be thorough you will have to check quite extensively on the issue.
There should be a local database that you can access to check USA registrations but it is a time expensive process as it is often difficult to actually search for an item that has no name but is instead an idea. It can be done but it takes patience.
I guess that the above is the reason that many people contract the services of a specialized patent attorney as they are more skilled at doing the appropriate searches.
[ Are there certain steps we can take in the future to avoid this problem? ]
There are two steps that I can think of:
1. Don't buy brand name products in China nor items that are clearly going to infringe upon the the patent/copyright of others.
2. Make specific checks on specific products with your customs authorities back home to ensure that the item/s that you are importing have the correct certifications to get through customs and be available for sale on the local market.
[I've heard that if you create a product and do not patent it, it is possible for another company to copy it and then PATENT IT THEMSELVES!! Is this true?]
No and yes. Legally if you can prove that the idea was not their original idea and already in the public domain then they cannot patent that idea. So if you see a product that does not have a patent you cannot rush out and patent it because it is already known to others and considered in the public domain.
Of course if you have an original idea and don't patent it and someone else picks up on that and does patent it before there is proof that it is already in the public domain then that would be a legitimate (although somewhat underhanded) patent.
[I've read a book where the author advised against getting a patent on the basis that if your product is successful enough, other companies will design around your patent and essentially copy your product legally.]
Strange advice.
The idea of a patent is to protect your original design. A patent is not meant to stop others from 'being inspired' by your original design and 'improving' upon it. So while a patent registration by its very nature will put the details of your design out there, this detail is what provides your original design with the protection that it deserves. If other make a product based upon your patent design but with small changes or improvements then that is legitimate business.
If you don't patent the idea then it will be a free for all especially if the product is successful!
28 Aug 2007 17:37
Post 4 of 5
Replying to [Egernia]:
Thank you for replying! Ummm, how small a change does it need to be to considered an improved design?
In the book I think the point was if you really do have a successful product, other companies will make such "small" changes to get around your patent anyway.
I'm weighing whether or not the time and effort to file a patent is worth it. How much time and effort does it really take?
Thanks again, I'm learning a lot here!
Thank you for replying! Ummm, how small a change does it need to be to considered an improved design?
In the book I think the point was if you really do have a successful product, other companies will make such "small" changes to get around your patent anyway.
I'm weighing whether or not the time and effort to file a patent is worth it. How much time and effort does it really take?
Thanks again, I'm learning a lot here!
30 Aug 2007 20:09
Post 5 of 5
[Ummm, how small a change does it need to be to considered an improved design?]
That depends upon how good your, or perhaps their, attorney is in the case of a dispute.
What is clear is that patent rights are not meant to all encompassing of the idea but instead to protect that exact design. If a patent right covered all possible improvements and deviations from the original concept then development would be stifled.
I think that the best guide would be that if you have a patent and someone copies your product exactly then you have a case, if they make reasonable changes then you can do nothing about that.
[In the book I think the point was if you really do have a successful product, other companies will make such "small" changes to get around your patent anyway.]
Yes that would be true, but the patent will at least protect your original idea which is the idea of patents.
[I'm weighing whether or not the time and effort to file a patent is worth it. How much time and effort does it really take?]
In most cases I would think that a patent is worthwhile in very few cases to be perfectly honest. The time and costs involved are not huge but can be cumbersome and time consuming.
I would think that a patent would definitely be in order for a totally new design concept that has multiple applications as patent royalties could be quite profitable from many possible sources here.
If however your concept has limited applicability then perhaps you are best to just go with it without an official patent and hope that copies don’t impinge too much on your future profits.
That depends upon how good your, or perhaps their, attorney is in the case of a dispute.
What is clear is that patent rights are not meant to all encompassing of the idea but instead to protect that exact design. If a patent right covered all possible improvements and deviations from the original concept then development would be stifled.
I think that the best guide would be that if you have a patent and someone copies your product exactly then you have a case, if they make reasonable changes then you can do nothing about that.
[In the book I think the point was if you really do have a successful product, other companies will make such "small" changes to get around your patent anyway.]
Yes that would be true, but the patent will at least protect your original idea which is the idea of patents.
[I'm weighing whether or not the time and effort to file a patent is worth it. How much time and effort does it really take?]
In most cases I would think that a patent is worthwhile in very few cases to be perfectly honest. The time and costs involved are not huge but can be cumbersome and time consuming.
I would think that a patent would definitely be in order for a totally new design concept that has multiple applications as patent royalties could be quite profitable from many possible sources here.
If however your concept has limited applicability then perhaps you are best to just go with it without an official patent and hope that copies don’t impinge too much on your future profits.
30 Aug 2007 21:55
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